BritishV8 Forum

Looks really good Calvin. I'm glad you found a solution for your filler neck. You can probably find a space saver that will work too, not all of them stick out on one side. The fuel neck manufacturers (one TRW company in particular) did a study on fuel flow in the filler tube. It turns out that the fuel flows in a spiral down the inner surface of the tube and the optimum size for this spiral is around 1-3/16" or 1-1/4" or thereabouts. Vapors are vented up the center of the spiral, meaning no separate vent is needed provided the bends don't get tight enough to collapse the spiral. The result of this study is that you'll find almost all cars built in the last decade use this same size filler tube. What this means for you is, should you find that the fuel puddles in your hose and causes trouble filling, you should be able to visit the junkyard and pick up some filler tube bends  which you can substitute in and get good flow. At least it's an option to keep in your hip pocket if you need it. Interestingly enough, the spiral runs the opposite direction down under. Just a bit of trivia I thought you might enjoy.

Jim

Jim, "Very interesting trivia" inputing all that you said does make sense with the fuel fill.

 I do have another filler neck that goes on the fuel cell, it has a very short 45*, if needed I could weld on another short 45* pipe so that the filler is about 3/4"above the cell and level to the cell. Doing this would take out the S in the filler tube.

The problem with the space saver is....think it won't make it in because of how high the back of the trunk is. There is 4 1/2" under the fuel cell. Think it won't make this angle in and under the cell.

I will take some 2x4 and make the 4 1/2" width/ 22" long and round the ends and check as a gauge for a space saver spare.

Don,  "That must have been a blast" seeing those brit cars on that kind of road "Beeeutifull country roads"

Do you have any problems with any purists in your club running your V8??




This is a gettyup photo for me "Saaaweeet"

Did you go here on the Ohio Adventure and end up at Ravens Glenn winnery? "WOW" a Carona and fill up Yogi's (Yogi Bear the cartoon) picnic basket with a few cases...ah bottles of wine,reds and whites.....a great way to forget responsibilities. What a life indeed. Looks like a great place to eat and test the wine.

Here in Cali I'm sure you know, Napa is chuck full of winneries. About a hour and 40 min drive from my house.

That's it I'm done working....I'm hiring some people to do my job and office work ....work on my build 24/7 and go on some road trips....I'm ready for it, Brenda is too. OK back to reality.



"Here"Gas prices now at the lowest costing gas stations is 4.45 a gallon. My thoughts on this #$%^&SUC.....





Worked on the driver side foot well today installing the sheet metal. The foot well came out pretty well not loosing to much room for gas pedal.

Calvin

Calvin,

Take your time, your doing a great job!

The local club is very accepting. The Western PA Triumph's Assoc. takes in all types and makes of cars.

http://wptriumph.org/index2.html

We run a lot of events in conjunctions with the Healey and MG Club and we co sponsor the Pgh Vintage Grand Prix / British Car Day in Pittsburgh, PA.

Hosting about 600 to 700 British Cars, and that does not include the different makes,Domestic and Foreign! We take over an entire Golf Course with over 3000 cars. ( not allowed on the greens )




So if you or anyone on the forum are in the Pittsburgh, PA area around July 19,20, come on down and check it out!

Yes, the pic-nic basket is not just for show, but function. Corona for me, wine for Debi! That's how I get her into the runs and car shows!

I say that when you get your TR6/GM done you set up a run thru Napa Valley, just about the time I come visit!

Nice Photo's Don. Huge turn out of Brit cars all lined up.

What kind of rollbar is that? It looks like it goes wider going into the car? It looks better than the norm.

Calvin

It's a lot of work, by a lot of club volunteers, and all the proceeds go to charity.(some $89,000 since we started)

The roll bar is from Rimmer Brothers, in England.
http://www.rimmerbros.co.uk:80/rimmer/triumph/tr6/accessory#Miscellaneous

It called an Alie Roll bar, dual bars, but only floor mount, not to the frame. Although with you skills you could make it to the frame.


Fitting is really tight and you must position the front bar mounting plate as far forward on the differential kick up in order for the soft top to still go up and down without conflict.

But I like the look, some what like the Triumph Stage and Benz 450SL!

I really like the looks of this roll bar, "Yes the 450SL Look".

It sure caught my eye on that photo of your's.

Is the top part of the bar have 2 pipes running along there?? Is that padding on the sides or sheet metal on the sides??

What is the overall height measurment? What size is the dia of the tubes? I know so may questions??

Sharp looking!

I may try to make this rollbar.

Thanks Don,

Calvin

Yes the roll bar is 2 pipes.

Padding

I'm not sure on the size of the bars, maybe 1 1/2, 1 3/4?


Outside width is 33"
Height to top leading edge is 27 1/4"
Depth on the mounting plates is 11" ( leading edge of the front plate to the trailing edge of the back plate)

Unless you extend this to the frame, it's more for visual, some protection, maybe.

If you notice in the picture of my car, I had to make a custom boot cover as the stock unit will work with a single bar but not with a double bar unit.

I'd go with 1 3/4 diameter, at least that's what NHRA recomends for roll bars, 1 5/8 will suffice if you go full cage but roll bar only is supposed to be 1 3/4 in chromoly that is, not sure what regs are for mild steel, it is a nice looking design though

For a different look, how about the following:




These are different ideas from 6-Pack. I like the first style (BMW) with the slant forward stance.

Don,

Thanks for the other rollbar pic's, some good idea's.

Jon, Nice to know the size 1 3/4" is standard for rollbar for NHRA. Thanks.

It has been hard to weld on the body sheel metal. So I'm taking Bill Youngs great plans for the Rotisserie and making one. The materials total will cost around the 400 range. Much less than buying one.

http://www.britishv8.org/Articles/Auto-Body-Rotisserie.htm
 
Will be using the worm gear for rotation "pretty cool Bill"

Will take some photo's and post soon.

I sure didn't like welding on my back.

Calvin

Calvin, in my opinion the best feature you can add to a rotisserie is a device that lets you change the rotation center relative to the car body. This is because as you add and remove parts the center of gravity changes. The HF worm drive is very limited in how much variation it will handle. For instance, bolting in the IRS means it now takes 2 people to rotate the body, and the crossover point gets a little scary. Doors and such would have the same effect. You can use a stronger worm drive, or you can make the CG adjustable. I think that would be the better choice. Knowing your abilities, I'd expect you could come up with a good design.

Jim

FWIW, I wouldn't even think about making a roll hoop in chrome-moly steel. IMHO, that's a material that's better left to professional, big-budget race teams. There are several reasons why mild steel is more appropriate, besides cost and easier availability. Among the reasons: you have to heat treat the welded areas of chrome-moly fabrications after creating them or you end up with a part with only similar strength as its mild steel equivalent, except with brittle welds. Brittle welds obviously aren't appropriate for roll hoops (or suspension parts.) When smart professional race teams do use chrome-moly, they farm out the heat treating to companies with elaborate equipment. Heat treating is not a job for do-it-yourselfers.      

The usual reason for preferring chrome-moly on a race car is that it can be spec'd with thinner wall thickness to save weight.

Adding a pretty layer of chrome over a chrome-moly fabrication is a sin... because it invites a condition called "hydrogen embrittlement"... making a broken weld even more likely.  

As for roll hoop tube diameters... that's just one criteria of selection. Obviously wall thickness is another, as is the construction of the tube itself (e.g. "seamless", "drawn-over-mandrel", etc.)

SCCA requirements are apparently quite different than NHRA...

I spec'd 1.75" seamless (DOM) mild steel tubing, w/ 0.090" wall thickness for the 6-point cage in my GT. A cage could have been constructed from 1.5" seamless tubing to meet SCCA requirements, and if I were a real racer I probably would have gone that way to save some weight. On the other hand, if I were a real racer there would have been a couple more (triangulating) tubes in my roll cage.

Jim,

I pictured you and Steve turning the roadmaster on your rotisserie and dealing with this weight issue :-) it must have been a little scary with weight offset. Very good point.

I won't be installing any heavy items on the body at all. All fenders, doors, hood, and trunk lid will not be going on the car body when on rotisserie. Only using rotisserie for installing very small amount of sheet metal. Will be cleaning the body tub and using for painting and prep work. So all in all it will stay fairly light in weight.

AS for CG some adjustment pins and telescope square tubing(2 different sizes) should work on attachment arms.

I'm using 4 1/2" OD and 4" OD sch 40 metal pipe for the rotating heads(one inside the other). At .250 thickness (each pipe) if the worm drive has a problem as a back up the 4"OD (inside pipe) pipe will have holes drilled every 1/2 " or so for adjustment position lock and the 4 1/2" OD pipe will have one hole going straight through the head with 1/2" dia 6" long pin.


Curtis,

Some good knowledge about chrome-moly, good info to know. If I was to build a roll bar, it would be out of DOM and probably 1.75.

I have a TR6 stock roll bar to start with and can modify later to the frame if needed.

Calvin

The SCCA also says that the main hoop is to be from one continuous piece, so no double hoop bars like above.

I think you can get by with a double hoop if the driver's hoop is the main one, but I expect the bracing would have to convey that image.

Jim

I believe you are correct on that assumption, Jim.

Jim wrote: "I think you can get by with a double hoop if the driver's hoop is the main one,"

I suspect SCCA's intent must have been to minimize the potential of failed welds or of buckling at tube intersections... As I understood the rules (and it's been a LONG time since I looked at them) the main tube that goes up and over the driver's head should be welded directly to mounting plates, not to other tubes. In other words, "continuous from mounting point to mounting point".  Of course bracing tubes get welded TO the main hoop... but that shouldn't compromise its integrity. I think that in the last illustration (i.e. the one with the blue background) the hoop for the drivers side breaks the rules because it doesn't extend down to a  mounting plate.

Finished the rotisserie, may need to weld in one more brace at a 45* angle on the upright. When mounting the body tub on the rotisserie, will have the 2000lbs worm drive on the front end of tub which is lighter. Did  some adjustment for CG and width for mounting (used 1/2" pinch bolts with welded nuts). Found some wide wheel casters which will roll easy on cement. The mounting pads, used 3/8" bolt welded on plate, welded plate to the attachment arm. The rotating heads, used synthetic wheel bearing grease and packed well. Used 7/16" bolts and threaded into 1/2' thick metal rotating head. Mig welded everything with flux core .030 wire. Made sure there was alot of penetration on all welds.

A few more pictures. Soon the body tub will go onto the rotisserie. Will be able to work on the tub and can work on the front frame skid plate frame area. The rotisserie took some time away from car progress but well worth making this roll around tool for holding the tub.

Moving ahead and looking forward to it.


Calvin

I have the body tub on the rotissarie now and was enjoying taking the sawsal to the body some and flipping it over with very little effort. I'm seeing areas of the body I couldn't see before, like stress cracks where the seat rail was installed. May weld on tabs of metal to mount rails to the frame for better support.

I will take some photo's and post them soon for others to see. I even still have a grin on my face when working on this project.

Making the rotissarie was well worth it.

Calvin

Hey Calvin,

Thanks for the hard work on my new rotisserie. You did a great custom job. When you have her broken in and ready for me to pick up, I'll send the shipper!

Keep the grin going, it's like mental therapy, and I need it about every other day.

I took the grand kids for a little spin in our private development this past weekend and it was great sharing the excitement.

Maybe we should start a movement, "Take a Child for a Ride" and build interest in our sport, hobby, illness for the future.


Just being a kid at heart!

Don,

These photos need to be entered in the having fun with our British car contest. The smiles you all have show how much fun ah I mean illness your having. Also notice the 6-pack emblem on the windshield! (Are you a member?)

Looks like a very nice private development you live in. (Sweet!)

Maybe we should start a movement, "Take a Child for a Ride" and build interest in our sport, hobby, illness for the future.

I'm in agreement with this illness, it's way better than myspace.com or video games that most kids are involved in these days. Get them out and show them a more productive illness addiction and adrenalin rush with eye hand coordination. :-)

Your very welcome on your new rotisserie :-)

 


I have found that with this project, I don't have the time for the hunting in the recycle yards for parts that I would like. So the shopping spree has been on the net probably 80% of the time.

OK posting of photo's for others to see.

These are the tools needed for car restoration at home that I use. I'm able to do everything myself without help moving stuff around engine, body, frame and lifting.

1. 2 ton break down engine lift.

2. H frame body lift with straps at 4 ends with eye bolt in the center. Has lift bar that is used with engine lift (in black on the cement by the red one for the engine lift).

3. Newly made body rotisserie,(Don W has his name one this one hehe).

4. Several furniture dollies 1000lbs (roll around LS1 w/transmission attached with little effort) to move body when not on the rotisserie or frame.

5. Engine stand not shown.









The rotisserie and body does fit in the one car garage at 17' long and can close the garage door.

Different views. Rotisserie looks like big engine stand on the ends of body.

It was 101 degrees when I took these photos. Was sweating a little.












My home is setup with a breeze way 1 car drive through that we installed a garage door opener on. In this court yard there is a one car garage facing a 2 car garage in the back. It's about 30' between the two garages. Its a sweet setup for me because I can keep all this closed off to my neighbors except one next door that we are good friends with.

Gota love this winch to rotate the body 360* with very little effort at all.


Rear bolted up using the original body to frame pads and washers.


Front bolted up same way.



Photo showing mods to trunk area for the 19 gal gas tank. I couldn't see this before sitting on the frame or the dollies.


Need to clean up all the tub to bare metal and will probably use Lizard skin ceramic coating or undercoating in the right areas.