BritishV8 Forum

QuoteFuel slosh will be towards the rear under acceleration.

So?  If you are that low on fuel you shouldn't be accelerating, you should be light footin' it!  

So first I shoved a short piece of rubber tubing into the bulkhead, with a wire tie threaded through it so I could pull it back out. This was to keep chips out of the line. When I cross drilled the fitting the drill made short work of the wire tie:


Here's how it looked just before deburring and clean-up.


...but there was enough left that with a strong set of forceps and some WD40 I got the plug out.


Finally, I was able to assemble the banjo and run the suction line to the pump.


That left wiring the pump, for which I used a DelCity Deutsch compatible rough service 2 pin connector which worked very nicely. I recommend the DC service kit, it costs $100 but has a whole bunch of connectors. Dan bought one and this is the first time either of us had had occasion to use it, and it worked well.

I still have to relocate the inertia switch. I expect to reuse the Ford switch I have and put it in the trunk in easy reach.

Jim

I think if you are going to get to the gas station, you will have to accelerate. And probably go uphill too. Unless you can coast all the way, in which case, who needs gas?

So yeah, the stock pickup might be a problem for putting a hole right in that spot. But, you could go 1-1/2" forward of it and run the arms diagonally. I expect that could even work better.

Jim

Yeah, I like that idea!

The only problem with it is that then you don't have anything down in the little channel which runs from the front to the center of the tank where the stock pickup is attached. But if you are essentially covering the rest of the tank with the arms that only amounts to a couple of ounces of fuel.

This is not a cheap fix. The mat itself, in 15 x 15" costs $300. Plus another $20 for each banjo fitting if you go that way, $10-20 each for any hydraulic fittings, $60 for an assembled fuel rated hose with JIC ends, and so on. Counting the pump, tubing and check valve plus the special fitting for the pump inlet you could easily be approaching $500 before you are finished with it, plus the cost of a quality regulator. (but again, good clones are available at greatly reduced cost)

I still think it's an elegant solution, and with time hopefully the cost will come down a bit. But it is almost certain to be patented (has anybody checked?) so maybe not all that much or that fast.

Jim

I think it's great.  I am more interested in a decently baffled tank, for now.

Did anyone have a picture of the stock tank with the round baffle taken from the top?

 I'd like to know where the round baffle is in relation to the center rib in the bottom of the tank. I now have all the fittings to do the Roadmaster.

 Incidentally, for anyone using a Bosch44 pump and keeping the check valve that comes with it, to do that you need a banjo fitting (12mm to 6an for a 3/8" fuel line, I think you can get that from Techna-fit.com) plus you need an acorn nut to seal off the top of the banjo. It's 12mm x 1.5 and oddly enough lug nuts are available in that size and will work.

Jim

I think Keith Tanner's HIWD includes that photo...

Good catch Curtis. That helps some, but he's done some modifications and I think he's moved things around a bit. Anyone else?

Jim

http://www.mgexp.com/phorum/read.php?1,2199740

Perfect. Thanks Scott.

Based on that, I should move 3 inches forwards of the rear end of the rib to avoid the tube end bracket.

Jim

Update: There has been a failure of the fuel pump which I've traced back to most probably air entering the system. The fuel pump has an internal component that looks like a wire wound choke, possibly put there for electrical noise suppression or to reduce brush arcing and this component was obviously overloaded and burned up, which indicates either an overload or an air pocket inside the pump. Considering no fuel drained out when I disconnected the lines the latter is indicated.

All components are acceptable back as far as the pickup mat, except that some swelling of the internal hose's jacket was observed. Internally it was unobstructed. The hose position was as installed so there was no indication of siphon issues. The tank had about 9 gallons of fuel when the lines were disconnected, about 3 gallons at failure.

It is possible, since the pump was installed near vertical with the inlet on top that air was in the pump and was never removed, however the lack of any fuel in the feed line would indicate other issues.

One possibility is that the membrane of the pickup was damaged upon installation. Since it had to be stuffed through the sender hole and it is a relatively tight fit this seem the most probable cause.

I have removed the Holley tank mat and installed a #8-AN bottom drain. But since the tank has no baffles I'm working on a low mounted gravity fed canister type filter to feed the pump which I will try to mount horizontally. My current thinking is that a horizontally mounted spin-on canister type filter can use a top bleed with a light check valve to return air to the tank and provide an uninterrupted supply. Fitting it in properly is the challenge.

Jim

I've been very happy with my Tanks Inc. in-tank fuel pump. Is your injection a return style?

Yes it is.
Eventually I plan to build a tank and some sort of in-tank pump will be a part of that effort I'm sure. But for now this will do. It does look a bit odd. I mounted the filter behind and below the inner fender skirt and there's a 1/2" line that loops around to the pump which is horizontal and just below the bottom of the tank. With the car on the ground you can see the filter, the line and the pump.

But, the supply side is gravity fed and there is no need for a lift pump. I also installed a bleed line on the filter back to the top of the tank and put a ball-check in that line. That will let the air or vapor out and help keep the filter full.

Less than perfect, but an effective stop-gap solution until I can get the new tank made. Fuel pressure is steady and I can get back to tuning the engine.  

Which pump did you use Jim? The PA-4 or the PA-6? I watched their video and it looks like a good system. Probably makes sense to use that.

Jim

Not particularly fuel tank pick up related, but has there been much experience with fuel line (stainless braid covered) degradation with return
type fuel injection installations? I may have experienced my problem due to the original tank being cleaned out by E10 fuel, but then again, maybe my fuel lines are affected? I have in the neighborhood of 1000 miles on my project, and ran into a loss of power issue. Investigation (and screaming from the pump)
led me to a clogged 40 micron after pump filter. The clog was a dark gray to black jelly-like. Articles I have read refer to oxidation of the oxygenated fuel
by the action of the fuel circulation in a return system. I have returned to straight gasoline, but that is becoming unavailable in some locations.
Dennis

I have the PA-4, the PA-6 wasn't available when I bought mine. I asked them if I needed to upgrade to the higher capacity pump and they said that the -4 would be plenty for what I have. If I ever put a 383 in it I may do the upgrade but that won't happen unless the pistons go south in the current engine.

I originally had used AN hoses in the fuel system but I switched over to SAE 30R9 fuel injection specific hose to avoid the deterioration issue.

Lots of ethanol-free gas in Corn Country.  

https://www.pure-gas.org/index.jsp?stateprov=IA

I went to metal lines. No degradation there. The only issue is movement of the engine which has to be accommodated some way. Teflon lined hoses are a safe solution. Putting loops in the line also works.

Jim

Carl is correct, so far there are plain gas sellers here in corn cob country. I want to travel to Minnesota and Michigan, states that don't appear to have a regulation regarding posting of ethanol content. I recall when this blend hit the market in the late 70's or so, and lots of trouble then. Maybe I'm overreacting-nah, couldn't be! I have steel (had aluminum for ease of bending, read article on E10 attacking aluminum, and tore it out) fuel lines except for sections just off the fuel tank to the T-shirt area, and again from the chassis rail just under the firewall to the fuel rail and the same for the return. Well, just something to chat about, now on to
driving when the temp goes down some. I will investigate the teflon, but the fittings are different I think. I sure would hate to replace all those pretty
AN fittings!
Dennis

Teflon hose should use AN fittings. Same as JIC.

Jim

It has been a couple of years since you did this Jim, are you still using the Hydramat? If so, are you happy? Would you do anything different if you had to do it again?

My post of July, '17 stated that I had removed the hydramat, I think I stated the reasons there.

Overall I was not that impressed with it, it really seems more like a gimmick when considering street use. Off road or racing may be different. I actually had better results by just positioning the tank pickup as a drain in the lowest point of the tank. I don't consider it to be worth the expense and certainly not worth the the trouble of stuffing it through the OEM sender hole without risking a puncture.

Jim