BritishV8 Forum

Jim,

You could just cut out the front mounting panel and not do the firewall.  You would lose some flow but probably would still work.

I have attached a photo of how much I had to remove from the front panel.

Richard

JIm,

Re Hyundai heater fan.

The squirrel cage is 1/4" wider than the standard cage and it fits inside the heater compartment with about 1/2 " between its outer edge and the back of the heater compartment so yes, you can fit it without removing the heater.

Richard

Jim, careful on wheel selection, there were at least 3 or 4 different spline designs over the MGB lifespan and they are not interchangable. That LE wheel wouldn't fit the early spline anyway.

Bill is right.   And rather than messing about with swapping for a later style column, perhaps we should do an 'all-call" for WHAT aftermarket wheel of a proper size (sounds like 14 or 15") have people installed on their 62-67 MGB's?     Get those people to send pics, what they paid, where they got it, etc.  

Maybe there is some cheap "Grant" wheel that looks okay for less than $100, etc.  

$.02

M

Bunch" of Grants pictured in Jeg's, 13-14". Cheap !

Spline is 5/8" (.620) x 36 spline. Can anyone confirm what hubs fit this?

JB

OK it looks like our best bet might be to change to a later column. I'm pretty sure I have at least some parts on hand but don't know the spline size. I'll check tomorrow and if we're lucky I may be able to mix-n-match parts and fit a later hub.

Put the car back together and did a couple short test drives today. I had to find a clip for the air valve blocker on the carb. It was back to running only on the primaries, but trust me, that was enough. Anyway when the secondaries open it really does wake up that big motor. Goes from too much power to JEEZ! in nothing flat. Surprisingly even traction from both tires given the open differential, as it gladly laid two even stripes up the driveway. I did get a little wheel hop though which was a surprise. I don't know if it was a fluke as so far it's been the only time it's done it. Anyway I think Carl is right in being concerned about the life expectancy of that T-5, and we'd be smart to get Steve to begin getting the 2004r I gave him ready as a replacement. There will be some cost involved with that, but at least it will hold up behind this engine.

Anyway the strut change worked out great and works well. Rick we may be good with these, I remember we swapped struts with somebody at Townsend whose were getting weak so as not to stress the glass. As long as they don't lose any more pressure we'll be fine I think.

The throttle cable support bracket has been modified for the 4th (5th? 6th?) and hopefully last time. Good thing too as very little of the original remains. It has a nice organic shape now though, not that anyone will ever see it hidden under the air cleaner tray. I bent the gas pedal so it will go closer to the floor and that helped with the steering wheel problem, but it still sort of feels like you're driving a tractor. That wheel seriously has to go.

I should be able to get some photos tomorrow.

JB

Sorry, still no pictures but maybe tomorrow. We're still in Thanksgiving mode around here, kinda laid back and lots of great food, I hope everyone out there enjoyed the holiday as much as we did.

I took the car over to Fillmore's drive in this evening, knowing full well that with the cooler weather and the drizzle that it would be deserted. And it was. But I got to go for a short drive and I agree with Steve, the more you drive that car the more you like it. It is just so understated. That may seem an odd thing to say about a car with big flares and a shaker hood, but it's just got such mellow manners. I jumped on the freeway for an exit on the way home and it wasn't until I got off that I realized how quiet the car is at speed. Max was right to install a sound system. Now if I could just get it to power up.

The BCCGC cancelled their Dec. meeting and I was informed that their christmas party is for members only, which I haven't been for a few years, so unless Eddie Cole can get me in (anyone have his phone number? PM me if you do please) it looks like they won't be seeing the car for awhile. But there are several businesses locally to whom I owe a visit with the car, so I will start with them and maybe run across some events I can take it to.

Oh, and the mods to the gas pedal helped quite a lot but there's a little more work to do there to get smooth movement.

At this point I'm thinking a work weekend some time in January should let us tidy up most of the remaining tasks on the car, but I'm going to need a pledge of support from a few of you who can come to help out.

JB

I got back late yesterday.  I do have a complete '76 steering wheel, hub, & horn button.  Needs to be cleaned up, but would work if it'll fit the steering column.  I also have a complete steering column from a '72 or a '74 (not sure which).  I didn't have a chance last night to check the spline count but the steering wheel was 15 1/2" diameter.  I'll check the spline tonight & verify if it fits on the extra column I have.

Jim,
I can come up in Jan and work.  My brother is having hip replacement some time in Jan, so that might be a problem.  Early in Jan would be better for me.

Steve

JIm:

re:  Sound.  Well, as you'll note on the List it still needs an antenna.   But we powered up an iPod and were cranking that at the shop!  

The fuses (except maybe for the new 30A?) are all tell-tale-- they glow RED if they are blown!    Uh... you sure you just haven't hit the "source" button or something?  :-)

RE: steering wheels.   Reminder that the dash light switch is in the left side cowling.   Also the column switches have all been "adapted" to the new harness.   (I think Tim adapted an OE harness, which is now looking to be Genius...    )    

IF swapping columns, remember to line up your Indicator cancel with the tires being straight!    On that column ('72?) it should just be a moveable clip, but on other cars/years, it's set to the column shaft itself.    Just be aware, etc......

You should have caught this one before, Boss.    Pretty dumb to be going back and redoing steering columns and wheels at this stage....  :-p

Live and learn.  

M

Don't worry Max, before Jim does anything drastic we have an option. I'll buy a new wheel and installation kit, just needed to know what year the coulumn was. It appears that it's a 69. That way we wouldn't disturb the wiring or dash fit. I thought the black leather with the satin aluminum spokes would be best for the car, what do you think?

Steve noticed there was a problem with leg clearance, I just identified the causes. Anyway, if you guys think a new wheel is the best answer it's fine with me, certainly it'd be easier than changing out the column. But Carl thinks a 14" wheel is too small. Here's a thought. Kelvin has offered to help with getting a matching hub and says a TR6 or early Spitfire wheel is a direct fit. We'd need a proper horn button of course but that could be worth looking into. Bill, any chance you could call Kelvin and see what's up with that?

The radio doesn't power up. I don't think it matters if the lights are on or not, though I haven't tried to turn on the radio with the lights on. I could try that if you think it'd work but it doesn't make much sense to me. Anyway there's no indication of power on the radio. I haven't looked at fuses yet, or any of the wiring, mainly I guess because the overall appearance is not exactly confidence inspiring. I'm not complaining mind you. I greatly appreciate all the work that went into getting the wiring installed. I just think it needs to be tidied up a bit.

Max, is the connector for the speedo sender still there in the box the gauges came in? The sender is there in the transmission but there's no pigtail. I don't have a clue what connector it would use. The pigtail should have been there. I'm guessing you guys didn't run any wires down to that area to hook up the speedo sender, would that be correct? If you can find the pigtail you could send me that along with a couple of appropriate wires to hook it up with if there was something in the kit designated for that. I think Rick said he used a pink wire. ;-)

On the alternator, there is a brown/yellow wire coming out of the plug and a matching brown/yellow wire in the harness but they are unplugged. There is a white/blue wire from the plug with a ring lug and I'm guessing it was hooked to the big terminal on the alternator. It is disconnected. Do you have the sketch for the alternator wiring that identified the plug connections? One should have been to the indicator light and the other should have been a sense wire that went independently to the battery, but of course if they were switched it would not work. Am I to understand that you guys fixed it by disconnecting it? I thought you guys knew what you were doing :-p

From all indications I will be going into the back of the dashboard to hook up the speedo at least. Steve said there isn't enough wire to pull out the guages so it sounds like the dash will have to come back off. That means everything will need to be fixed at one time, including loose instruments, the choke cable that is hard to pull (doesn't seem to work) and the tachometer that doesn't work. Max, do you have the directions for hooking up the tach and speedo? Nothing came back with the car. I'm going totally by guesswork here. I'm inclined to think that the easiest way to get a solid tach signal is going to be to install the MSD and programmable advance box, and use the MSD tach output. Thankfully the instructions for those came back with them. Steve and I identified the connections and the install looks straightforward enough once I find a suitable location. Might help with dialing in the timing advance too. I see we have two wires coming out of the distributor. Anyone know what we have in there?

JB

I sent Kelvin an e-mail asking if he could arrange any sort of a discount on the 15" Tourist Trophy wheel that Moss sells, but no reply yet. I'll go that way if we have to have a 15" wheel, but personally most MGBs run a 14" aftermarket wheel just fine but perhaps with the extra weight up front and wide tires we need the extra leverage. The Moss wheel is almost $100 more than the one from VB, enough to warrant some questions for sure. I sent Carl a message asking his opinion on a 14" wheel as well.
We'll get it sorted out before Christmas for sure Jim, just want the Roadmaster to have something in it's stocking on Christmas morning.

Jim,
 wires in back of alt.  They are disconnected because with the attached the battery went dead.  It works as a one wire and self excites.
I ran a blue wire from the temp gauge to the sender and left the green one in place.

Steve

The steering on the car is probably lighter than stock. Remember it has those 17" wheels and the steering knuckle actually sits inboard or closer to the wheel centerline by a couple inches. I don't know what Carl is running for an offset or tire width but I know his wheels have to be offset farther to the outside because he is running 14" rims and the knuckle has to clear the rim and tire. So as likely as not a 14" steering wheel might be OK. Kelvin responded to me that he'd like to contribute to the project Bill, he mentioned a 15" black Motolita wheel and hub. What do you guys think about black? Personally for that type of wheel (3 spoke drilled) I'd rather see polished aluminum but Bill, whatever you can work out with Kelvin or otherwise is fine by me. I trust your judgement. Something in the 14-15.5" range I'd say. He has contacted me via MGE PM but I really wish we could all discuss it in the same place. I feel like the middleman in keep-away.

It looks like the speedo sender probably uses the pigtail that fits a #881 fog light bulb. (Has two locking tabs at the sides) I've not been able to find one though. Any help?

Alternator: I don't know about being self exciting but if it works that way I'm fine with it, I guess we'll see. Normally the indicator wire is turned off with the ignition and the sense wire (Brown/Yellow? Blue/White? Has to be one or the other.) has to go through a relay to keep it from draining the battery, which it certainly will do if it is wired up directly to the battery, or perhaps more appropriately in this case, to the large yellow wire. I'm pretty sure that was on the diagram.

JB

QuoteWell, as you'll note on the List it still needs an antenna

That's cause nobody wanted to drill the hole in the new paint.  I thought we should mount the antenna horizontally under the dash. No external antenna. The megawatt station will come in. The heck with the rest.

Steering wheel:

On my car, when cornering, a 14" wheel felt like the car was driving me. A 14.5" wheel provided more leverage & confidence that the car would go where I pointed it.

We won't really know what feels right on the Roadmaster until we try 'em. A 14.5-15" wheel should be great, but a 14" might feel fine.

Bill, that black leather steering wheel would look awesome!

Forgot to mention, I have many, many years experience (38+) driving a MG with a 16.5" steering wheel. My dad's '63 B & my sister's '53 TD.  The big wheel seriously encroaches on the leg room.  So, whatever we need to do...

Jim:

See answer from Steve re: Alt wires.   The brown/yellow is the ignition light wire.   (See diagram I sent you.)    As he says, ignore the connections-- they kept the light on and killed the battery.  

The ONLY "wiring diagram" we were given for the ancillaries was the instruction with the HDI lights.   There was nothing for the alternator-- we only copied (with the new harness) what had been there before.   You mentioned swapping the black/yellow and white/blue-- we didn't try that.  (We were worried about alternator.   Steve has had it checked and has reinstalled it.   If he says it's working, then it's working!)


RE: Gauges.  NO INSTRUCTIONS.   There were none in Kentucky when I wired them up for the first start up, and there were none when it came to FC.  (Rem:  late night phone call to Guzman?!?)   I'm not sure why the green/blue in the harness didn't work on the temp gauge, but Steve ran a separate wire and apparently that does make that gauge work.    I've never seen the Tach work correctly.   Dan and I tried every combination (5-settings) in Kentucky in the blessed hours and it NEVER read correctly.  

RE:  Speedo.   What came with the gauges was an Angle Drive for an MGB-style speedo (NOT a T5 tranny with electric sensing).   No pigtail, else we would have put it in.   IF there had ever been such, I have no idea.   There IS a green wire for you to plug into, once you get it wired.  It's up by the pedal box area.   :-)   Carl thought you could just get the appropriate pigtail from an appropriate Chevy.  :-)

RE:  tach.    The wires are all ring terminal and nuts.   Given access from behind (read:  "upside down, stick head in foot well"  :-) ) it can be disconnected.   The dash is wired with it's own harness-- yes, it means No slack in wires (to "keep it tidy"), but it also means less mess-- no labelling required, etc.-- and easily removed.    I would *strongly* consider just trying a "normal" 4-cylinder tach and seeing if it reads double.   That at least would verify the wiring and condemn the SW tach for good....

RE:  distributor.   There is a Pertronix under the cap.    If you hook up the MSD, note that it does NOT work with a Lucas tach!  (Whether that means it also won't work with the SW, I don't know.   At 5000 rpm the tach goes totally haywire.   This is a known problem in the racing community, and why you rarely see anyone racing with a Lucas tach!  (And if they are, they are usually still racing with Points!))

RE:  radio.   Should come on with the key.    With gauges being messed with it's possible some connection has been "disturbed".  I would probably check the ignition switch wires first-- whites or white/green (if there is one.  I'm forgetting.)    The memory setting (clock, presets) is off the purple circuit in the center console-- if the power outlet works and the interior light works, then so should the radio presets.   But the MAIN radio power comes from the ignition switch.  


Bill:  I think that's a GREAT idea with the Steering Wheel!    A 14" will only be 1.25" in from each side-- I don't think it'll be too small.   (I've run 14" Momo on a couple of my cars.)      It'll block the view of the gauges somewhat, but neither of the big gauges is working right now anyway.   :-)  :-)  

Cheers,

M

Ok guys, I'll order a wheel today, Jim you should have it by early next week. We can always change it if it proves too small for one of the larger 15" wheels from Moss or such. If no one else has a need for the original wheel I'd like it to use as a base for another of my cut down wheels like I did for the A and I could use the horn button on my MGA as well as I don't have a good one for that wheel.

Jim,
When you start first Roadmaster and let it idle, the volt meter will read battery voltage.  Rev the engine and the voltage goes up to 13-14 and then stays in that range, whether at idle or above.  It will vary some, but not much.  It needs about 1500 rpm to self excite.

steve

Steve, how the heck did you discover that? Who would have thought that the Japanese alternator we put on the car would work by just connecting the heavy battery lead and nothing else? Then again, why wouldn't it? It just makes sense to build it that way if you think about it. But the thing is, the implications of this go much farther than just fixing the charging system on the GT. By and large Japanese electronics share many commonalities so it is entirely possible that this feature is common to most if not all Japanese alternators. (Another common feature is the need to disconnect the sense wire with a relay to avoid draining the battery.)

What this means to us is that there is a very good chance that we can go out and grab almost any Japanese alternator, mount it, belt it up, hook up a battery wire and be done with it. Not only does this greatly simplify the wiring but it cleans up the engine bay at the same time.

Nice find!

JB

Jim/Bill:

Shouldn't be a worry with Horn Button on the "new" wheel-- I'm pretty sure the '69 is a horn button on the Stalk Switch!   :-)

Jim, verify?  :-)

M

QuoteWho would have thought that the Japanese alternator we put on the car would work by just connecting the heavy battery lead and nothing else

My Delco CS121 74amp alternator works the same way - just a heavy battery feed and one connection at the 'L' terminal for the charge light (which is optional).

You're right about the horn Max, I am using the early B column in my A for that reason as well as to get rid of the original MGA vacuum type turn signal switch. I called it a horn button, but all it is is a decorative cover for the wheel center.