BritishV8 Forum

Any one have any experience with dry sump systems?

I've been trying to figure out how to do it without costing an arm & a leg. The full systems are very high. The biggest expense is the multi-stage pump. I think a 3 stage would be fine for what I want. I believe I could rig the rest like the oil reservoir, breather tank, & lines. Seems to me, I could even get by with the stock oil pan.

Layout what the benefits of using the dry sump system would be for you. (This is just for my own better understanding). Ground clearance, Oil cooling, Larger oil volume in system, Easier access to pump system?

Thanks Bro!

I bet you could get away with the stock oil pan but you don't get the benefits of efficient scavenging then, right? If you are a decent fabricator you could make a crankcase cover that has a thin sump that runs the length of the crank... That's what I would consider. How about toping it off with a nice crank scraper?

There is definately a lot of money to be hemorrhaged in the parts associated with a dry sump. I think you're right the pump is the critical part. The rest I bet you could fabricate. COOL!

Just a word of caution;  I ran a dry sump on my Ford 351 SVO race motor
The dry sump system creates multitude of issues . The oil tank needs to be constructed so as to seperate the air from the oil.
The engine needs to be a sealed assembly with a small orfice in the breather on the engine to maintain approx. 10 in. of vacum.
The pump mount is critical for proper belt alignment and tension.The pan should have at minium a crank scraper , or better a windage tray.The breather should be connected to the oil tank , not the engine. This also will require a remote oil filter . You will need a lot of space . Might I suggest an Accusump system as an alternative.

Good luck
Dennis Douville

I'm running a small block Ford w/dry sump. The guy to go to for this is Gary at http://www.drysump.com  The complete system for my motor ran $2600 and included the pan, breather, oil tank, pump, pullies, harmonic balancer (built especially for the system), and all the fittings - everything except the lines. I think his outfit is ARE (Armstrong Race Engineering, I think). Nice guy, knowledgeable, responsive to questions (from idiots like me). The GT-40 crowd uses his stuff quite a bit, for those not using Aviad. The pan was ultra low - only 4" deep - and shouldn't require the x-member to modified in the 'B'. Best way to reach him is e-mail through his web site.

Hmm!
Very interesting and Gary is only 20 miles away from me. I may go to his shop and check out his products.

Thanks David for posting Garys website.

Calvin

Calvin,

Gary has quite a bit of stuff for LS-1 motors. The Ford end of things is pretty sparse (I'm used to it). I get the idea that his main trade is to the race crowd. Take a look at his various packages. They seem to include everything someone would need in order to go dry sump including technical support.

Nicolas,

I want to eliminate the wet sump problems that come with racing conditions such as oil sloshing in the pan, oil aeration, & parasitic horsepower loss from oil accumulating on the crankshaft. A quality baffled pan would make a good start on a multi stage sump pump. I do have acrank scraper.

An added benefit to the dry sump is the relief of crankcase pressure, so the rings will seal better (maybe a few more HP) and my blowby problems will be resolved.

I'm thinking a used/rebuilt 3 stage pump from Ebay will get it started & I'll fab the rest.

If any one runs across a reasonable priced cast aluminum dry sup pan for a Buick/ Rover, please let me know.

Everyone I know in SCCA road racing seem to use Accusumps to maintain oil pressure in case of oil pickup failure in the wet sump due to oil surge or oil pickup failure in the sump. Before ever going out onto the track I will most certainly be using an Accusump on my Rover 3.5 V 8 along with a big,bright red warning light for low oil pressure.  Nine quarts of oil, a huge oil cooler,  and two oil filters help, too.  The biggest, best baffled sump possible is a must, well constructed to avoid contact with the tarmac.  Don't forget a good oil temperature gauge with a big, bright red warning light.

Phillip G

I have been looking into this mainly because the stock oiling system is so poor on these engines..
I started by looking into a single stage external pump from R&R. I have a friend who built a Buick 350 bracket engine with this single stage external pump and the owner loves it.

http://www.rrconnectingrods.com/oil.htm

I have also found someone who makes a dry sump cast pan.

http://www.drysump.com/pan8a.htm

hoffbug Wrote:
-
> I have also found someone who makes a dry sump
> cast pan.
>
> http://www.drysump.com/pan8a.htm

Yeah, I'd love to have one of those, but $568 for a cast aluminum oil pan I can't justify.

http://www.drysump.com/pan8a.htm

I hear ya!.. The cast pan would be nice for the street though..
Im not sure what Im going to do yet as Im still in the planning stages. Nic is a lot further along than I am.

Don't forget the complete replacement of the oil pump - base and all the gears.  Also a new oil pump pressure relief spring is important on most systems, as well as the biggest oil cooler you can fit.

Phillip G

Hi all, I also have questions about this topic.

All Canton SBF road race oil pans are designed for a system capacity of 7-9 quarts so I'm thinking 8-10 qt capacity in a dry sump set-up should be OK. Does my logic seem allright?

How important is mounting the breather tank remotely rather than breathing out of the main tank?

What is the advantage to sealing the lifter valley and how large a take-off does one have to provide there (where, size)?
Can pulling oil from the lifter valley potentially cause problems for hydraulic lifters?

If using the original (in block) pressure relief valve, how do you return the overpressure (from the relief valve) to the pump?

many thanks,
Bernard

Ford Small Block 331 AFR 185 road race/street driven -forged internals, 7000rpm max