BritishV8 Forum

Yeah, actually there are a lot of systems that are standalone and need only power to function. The latest ones, probably not. But I'm specifically looking at '90-'94.

Jim

Modern ABS is complicated & tied into several systems, including traction & stability control using a lot of computer.

Like I said, have fun.  I am confident that you are up to the challenge & are looking forward to it.

I am aware. I am pretty competent at it myself, in fact I'd even venture to say I've had more practice at it than you have Carl, considering you never use your brakes  . What I can't do is threshold brake each tire on it's own independently and modern ABS can do that, so neither of us have much chance of beating a really competent system. Some are better than others. So far, the system on my Alfa has been flawless and it's made a believer of me. That is one fast car. I have yet to exceed it's limits even after Townsend this year if that tells you anything. Pete was in my way    .

There are different levels too. For instance, the Mk60 comes in different flavors. The mundane one starts to freak out over perceived ice at a slippage rate just over 5% where the one I'm looking for remains stable up to about 15%. That's a big difference which mostly relates to being suitable for track use or not.

But even without the ABS something had to be done. Pedal pressure with a dual MC/balance bar system is way too high to be safe. You went to a dual diaphragm vacuum booster, I'm going to a hydroboost. The ABS is just one more added component. Plus the sensors of course. So I might as well do it. Pave the way so to speak. Still, it'll be a staged approach since I'll have to pull and machine all four rotors, mount sensors, and run a LOT of brake line. To say nothing of figuring out where to put stuff. That's going to take more time than swapping out the pedal box.

Jim

Well, have fun. 

We have survived a very long time without ABS.  We know how to threshold brake. Early ABS was not so good. I can out-brake those.  In fact, I have the ABS on my 2000 Silverado disabled.

Much research has been accomplished, some parts ordered, and a plan established. Quite a lot of research and figgerin' really, almost like an engineering project.

So it became pretty obvious early on that the late pedal box would have to be used to allow room for parts, and the balance bar had to go. I'll find another use for the big walnut knob under the dash.

Next thing I found out, my Jag rear brakes and Outlaw front calipers are in pretty close to perfect balance, around a 64/36 split which I can probably live with as an interim configuration between stages. Next is that I will only have about 12" between the pedal bracket and one of my header tubes, making part selection a bit difficult.

However, the Wabsco pump/accumulator unit is very versatile and will work with numerous hydroboost units, leaving the ABS and sensor package to be added later as a second stage. Drilling a pattern of holes in the inner face of each of the brake rotors can provide the required wheel sensor arrangement.

Those hydroboost units? They work well with several solenoid/controller packages, some of which are self contained, leaving only the sensors themselves. Fortunately the right selection of units means the main pump and the ABS can be located almost anywhere.

So selection of the hydroboost and MC are kinda critical and almost killed the project. But as it turns out, the Germans used a nicely compact hydroboost in the BMW e23 7 series, one of which had the mounting flange about 1/4 of the way along the bore, and in combination with the MC gave about an 11 inch overall length so it ought to fit. Also from BMW was the ABS, a Mk60 Teves unit, but not just any Mk60, oh no. It had to be special and hard to get naturally. Still working on that one.

All of these parts *can* be extremely expensive but don't have to be. I prefer not to pay the BMW tax myself, so I've managed to cut costs pretty well so far. In the end I don't think total expenses will hit the 1k mark, but they won't be all that far below it.

And what do we get for all that then? Well initially brakes that have a light pedal and work very very well. After that, anti-lock suitable for a race track if I get the right ABS unit. At the very least excellent street manners.

I'll take some photos once parts start to arrive.

Jim

Looks like she received a very nice kayak!

PM on separate WTB sent.

It's been a heck of a spring, and summer, and whatever it is now!
Trying to make progress on car stuff, but there's been other shop stuff taking precedence.

A kayak for my wife, for instance:


Anyway, here's the damper/puley package assembled on the front of the crank:


And with no block (still...), I turned an aluminum dummy pilot bearing and pushed the crank onto the transmission shaft, and supported the front with some rope. Now I know I can install the front suspension pieces without fouling the engine's spinny stuff. If this pic makes ya nervous, I can tell you I was being crazy careful while doing this, with pads and wood blocks underneath so it couldn't fall or scrape anything.


And two views of the bottom coilover mounts tacked in place, with fixed-length 'dummy' stand-ins now installed.




I'm continuing to keep shopping for the project, while life keeps me busy for the moment. Set of wheels, a mid-rise lift, and so on. I also drove down and spent a morning at the vintage races at the new-ish Ozark International Raceway, mostly walking the pit/garage area getting ideas and a feel for the 'look' of a vintage racer, more or less.

On the rover, is that the Bosch 5.3?  It seems to me it was one of the makes Grok mentioned, as well as MGF

Been looking at Rover parts since I have the pump assembly already. In the mid 90's they used a system that had a separate pump and then a control assembly which also has a smaller pump for return flow and the reservoir, the M/C and a link for the pedal. With the late bedal box I think it might fit the MGB. Big reservoir, it holds about a quart but that's required due to the nitrogen charged pressure vessel on the pump assembly. It's recommended to push the brake pedal 30-40 times with the key off before checking the fluid level. This may not all be completely accurate as there were a number of variations in the bits used.

A question that has come up is how the controller acts on ice or when it thinks there is ice. Apparently it can be fooled into stopping very slowly under some conditions. The Delta controller does not have this "feature" as it is a race oriented system which they claim is suitable for competitive FIA applications, however I suspect it might be just a somewhat less sophisticated controller, in the fashion of aftermarket engine controllers and such.

Jim