Intercooler condenser placement ?

[BlownMGB-V8]

We've got some really sharp people on here so I've decided to seek opinions on this very nebulous question of whether to place the condenser for the intercooler (liquid medium) between the A/C condenser and the radiator or out in front?

I know it can go either place and probably work fine. But, here are the two sides of the coin I'm trying to metaphorically flip here. On the one hand, I will undoubtedly use the A/C much more than I will need the IC and when I do it will without a doubt be for short bursts of probably less than 10 seconds. That would seem to argue for putting the A/C condenser out front to get maximum comfort.

OTOH, the A/C system is undoubtedly going to be oversize and have excess capacity and putting the IC behind it will preheat the IC condenser (not a real big deal since the  fluid in the IC condenser will return to the tank when fresh fluid on demand is pumped in through the IC evaporator and will not return immediately to the IC, although heavy use could warm the fluid in the tank if the condenser is not 100% effective).

Then too, the IC pump will only circulate fluid under boost and for a short period afterwards so preheating the A/C condenser should not be too much of a concern, but efficiency could go down a bit when I call for power.

So what do you guys think? Both condensers are big, about 17 x 30 x 3/4" thick.

Jim

[DiDueColpi]

Hey Jim,
What about ditching the IC condenser entirely?
If your AC system is big enough you can tap into it with a heat exchanger for the IC system.
It would free up some room at the front of the car and provide a super cooled intake charge.
A heat exchanger in the tank would be ideal, and if the tank is sized well, provide the reserve you need for extended use.
Cheers
Fred

[BlownMGB-V8]

A good thought Fred, but it turns out that the A/C system doesn't have nearly enough thermal density to do the job, pretty much regardless of the configuration, unless maybe you ran the A/C all the time. The freon just won't absorb enough heat. Water is the best but it freezes The best practical liquid was n-pentane, which makes up about 50% of gasoline. (Well, pentane does anyway.) This results in a mixed discharge (vapor and liquid) atmospheric pressure system with boil-off beginning at just around 100 degrees or slightly above. That could be discharged back into the tank but I chose to cool it first. Hot fuel just didn't seem like a good idea.

The condensers are mounted, I just need to run the lines.

Jim

[MGB-FV8]

Jim, working with Ford Escape Hybrid in our fleet, I've noticed that it has a neat water cooler condenser and a circulating pump that carries the coolant to the certain hybrid components and brings it back to the front cooler for its cooling cycle.  Is it possible to install your IC in a remote place with an electric fan to provide flowing air through the cooling fins?!?!  If I'm not mistaking, the Escape uses the same plain anti-freeze in its seperate holding tank.  There's a lot of industrial equipment that have their cooler installed in a remote place with a thermostatic switch and fan attached to it.  You might be able to insert it behind/inside the back part of the fender?!?!

Just a thought, maybe I'm not following your thoughts?!?!

[Moderator]

Yeah... you lost me at "a/c". (You probably knew that.) I'm not clear whether you're really looking for technical ideas or just help with prioritization. From a priority point of view... you're talking about a lightweight car with a silly amount of power, so the incremental gain from a slightly better IC placement is more theoretical than practical. On the other hand, you're talking about air conditioning an open and uninsulated car with hardly any solar load that's predominantly driven in a mild climate. Who cares how well the a/c works!  You could think of the decision in these terms: "What STATEMENT would I be making by placing the ______ out front?" (If it comes down to that, surely IC wins.)



p.s. Does one option give you better hose routings or more elegant bracketry than the other? Can you service the forward location more easily? If so, which heat exchanger is more likely to need service? Will the heat exchangers be visible? If so, which one is prettier? FWIW, I think you should label the IC so people will be impressed that you have one. What percentage of superchargers do?

[BlownMGB-V8]

Hmmm, never thought of that. A logo of some sort on the IC? I like it.

Apparently I never posted a photo after I got the condensers mounted. I'll have to remedy that, but I'm still getting used to this camera/phone/email/bluetooth/wonderbra/... no, wait, that wasn't right.

So the condensers are as big as the radiator (but much thinner) and mounted in front of it and both are identical, no difference at all. Won't be much difference whichever way I plumb them as far as the lines go so it's mainly just a choice of performance, comfort and maybe appearance. Although realistically I could paint "Intercooler" on the front one either way and nobody would know the difference.

From a design\\engineering standpoint all the work has been done already, all the hard parts are installed except the circulation pump and only the lines remain. (plus the evaporator for the A/C but that comes later). And really only this one decision remains.

It may seem like the IC is superfluous but with a 10.6 CR it really is not. Any boost at all will require cooling of the intake charge. So the IC does need to be efficient. Maybe I just answered my question. And when you put your foot in it, who worries about the A/C?

Jim

[Moderator]

When you put your foot down, more air blows through your hair!

[roverman]

With a mid to rear mounted cooler: A. right behind the cockpit area, under a grille, with verticle discharge produced by fan(s).This could function similar to the engine bay grille on Porsche 914's.  B. Even more bizarre might be live telescoping tailights, or a rear mounted grille, for air exiting of a rear mounted cooler.  Cheers, roverman.