Electric windows

[BlownMGB-V8]

I saw the photo of the dor of Martyn Harvey's project and he seems to have a different sort of electric window setup. So what's the latest?

Jim

Here is the link to Rob's electric window thread:

http://forum.britishv8.org/read.php?8,2955

[rficalora]

He used a unit from some sort of Toyota pick-up if I recall (could be way off on that, just what I seem to recall).

I got the AutoLoc ones (PW5500).  The motor can be remoted.  Haven't installed them yet; hope to soon.  Will let you know how they work out if you're not past this by then!

[harv8]

I thought I'd try this set up from Victoria British. It was quite inexpensive and on sale when I bought it some time last winter.
It is a very easy installation.  I hope it's going to be reliable.

[BlownMGB-V8]

Any photos you guys could post would be a big benefit.

Jim

[74ls1tr6]

I have the ones from BV. I will dig them out, take several photos for you today Jim, and post.

[rficalora]

May be installing mine this week; will take pics if i do.

[74ls1tr6]

[74ls1tr6]

[74ls1tr6]

Made in Taiwan---------------------<

[rficalora]

That's the sort typically referred to as a "Universal" kit by the Hot Rod vendors isn't it Calvin?  I read mixed reviews on those when I was researching.  Most folks with smaller/lighter windows seemed to think they worked well; folks with heavier/older cars & those with tight cranking regulators had trouble with them.  I'll be interested to hear how they work for you.

[74ls1tr6]

This one came from British Victoria. I don't know if it will work for the TR6 at this point. It hasn't even seen a door yet. It will be interesting and will let all know how it goes. Probably will make better parts for it it the end, or even go a different route.

Taiwan made Hmmm!

[MGBV8]

Interesting that y'all are adding weight with this mod.

A local club member plans to do track days at VIR. He welded in a a really tall roll bar & stripped out the door guts. It's amazing how light an MGB door is without the window glass & regulator! Hmmm.  

[74ls1tr6]

Agree on added weight. Just need to make another car for autoX ("dreaming")

I know if I was single and didn't have a wife, my build would be way lighter without all the ceature comforts added, so to even make the build, needed to sell her on the idea first, but had to add what she wanted. Have learned if wife is not happy, no one happy! :-)

[rficalora]

The AutoLoc PW5500 I'm bought (yet to install) keeps the glass, but loses the regulator... The replacement track, motor, cable is probably 1/3 the weight of the MG regulator.  But, i think the glass is where the real weight is.

[MGBV8]

Have learned if wife is not happy, no one happy! :-)

Words of wisdom for all husbands.  Know it, learn it, live it!


Rob,

You're right. Hmmm, I don't use my windows much anyway, so maybe the hot ticket would be your lightweight power windows plus lexan. End result, lighter & that window crank handle will be out of my knee's way for good!

[Moderator]

When I worked for Volvo Trucks (and "WhiteGMC"), we were building such wide truck cabs that there was no possibility a driver could manually roll down a passenger-side window without standing up and walking over. We always offered two power-window options: you could get a motor on just the far-side window or on both. (On the earlier model trucks you could get either air or electric windows - so actually four options!)

An MGB or a TR6 is so narrow that the usual main reason for power windows is gone, at least for gorilla-armed people like me. This Sprite owner retrofitted MkI (bugeye) doors to his MkII to lose window weight: http://www.britishv8.org/Other/RichardBondy.htm    To each their own!

[Jahdave]

I used a set that I bought from Moss Europe.  They work well and have been installed for 5 years now.  I cannot remember how much I paid for them, but I do recall that they were an easy installation.  The window regulator is now out of my way on the door.  I'll post pics soon.

[Bruce Mills]

Where about are you electric window guys running the wiring into the door.

The reason I ask is I shaved my door handles and the looms I used (SS Braided door looms) failed very quickly and I am looking for a better idea

Thanks


Bruce

[Bill Young]

Bruce, anytime you place wiring where it will flex you will have failures. Probably the most reliable contact for power windows and door locks is through a spring loaded contact strip such as then ones sold by Painless Performance. The windows and doors will only work when the doors are closed, but then you shouldn't need to operate them when open anyway. They make a 5 contact strip suitable for a door with electric windows, power locks, and a doom light switch. http://www.painlessperformance.com/webcatalog/largeview.php?SearchField=40025

[rficalora]

By the way, I worked on the AutoLoc PW5500's today... no good.  Channel can be cut down to fit with the motor remoted, but there's no place it'll fit... it's too big to fit between the glass & the inner door panel.  I'm back to the Moss sissor type regulator as the only good alternative.

[Bruce Mills]

Thanks Bill

Looks exactly what I should have .

I have send a letter off to Painless with regards to the contact dimensions in hope it will cover the hole I have already drilled.

Bruce

[BlownMGB-V8]

My last trip to the pick-n-pull I grabbed a pair of electric window mechanisms out of a Mazxa RX8 and have been adapting one of them to my passenger's side door. Been a bit of a struggle but I finally got it to work and I have a bunch of photos I can share with y'all, though there were so many revisions along the way that some details will have to wail until I get the driver's side done. No photos in this post but I'll get them added soon.

Now the Mazda unit is not the ideal, but it is usable. It is cable operated with a fairly typical motor/gearbox reducer unit and the linear motion device is  a metal track with a plastic slide that attaches to the window glass with two 6mm screws. This can be fastened to a modified piece of the old mechanism. There are two flex cables joining the track to the gearbox.

The RX7 track is 3" too long The Mazda3 track is an inch or two longer than that and has longer flex cables. A Mazda6 track would be similar, perhaps a bit larger. Any of these could be used, in retrospect the others would allow positioning the motor forward of the window track in the area where the original crank was located. But the track and one cable have to be shortened to 11-3/4" of travel.

The RX7 track has 14-3/4" of travel. To shorten it, the lower clip must be removed from the "T" shaped cutout, 3" cut off of the length of the slide, and a new cutout made in the track. I used the old end and scribed the shape, drilled around it with a 1/8" bit, used a chisel to cut between them and filed off the nubs. Crude but effective. Shorten the opposite cable.

To do that I made a new cable end out of brass. You can use 1/4" brass rod, drill a 1/16" hole in it and then cut it to length. I marked the cable, taped it with masking tape, cut the end off with a zip wheel, slid off the tape, threaded it into the hole and slid it up to the mark. Then silver soldered it, trimmed off the excess and reassembled. Perfect.

Positioning of the track can be tricky. It has two mounting studs, one of which is removed when you shorten it. I made a metal bracket to attach the remaining stud to two of the original mounting slots in the door, allowing the track to pivot. To attach the slide I cut the MG window attachment off the stock mechanism. This has two spring loaded pins on a sliding bar. I welded a reinforcing strip to the center of the bar and then drilled and tapped that to bolt on the slide.

Now, the angle of the slide needs to be pretty close to the angle of the window tracks. It is possible to cock the window and this was where the trouble occurred. I ended up with the new track very slightly angled forward at the top and it has worked for me. If your reinforcing strip is long enough you can have several sets of mounting holes at different angles. Each may require slight variations in your pivot bracket but the sliding bar will allow some movement. Any angle other than the one that matches the window tracks will cause the cables to flex or the motor to move, another instance where the Mazda3 unit may be better suited. I originally came home with Mazda3 tracks but returned them to get the RX7 ones. In retrospect I think that was a mistake as the motor sat right on top of the front window track and there isn't much sheet metal there to bolt it to.

Now the switches are another item entirely. I came home with two passenger side door switches. The motors have 2 leads, you switch them to reverse. Simple enough. Any double pole double throw switch will do that. However, that's not how they wired them. They had a driver's side master. So these switches are more specialized and so far I have not been able to sort out how to make them work with only one switch. It must be possible, I just can't see how.

One side of the switch has 3 contacts. Spring loaded to center of course. The center contact makes with one pole in standard NO fashion. The other contact is the same but also closed when the switch is centered. So one contact is ON-OFF-OFF and the other is OFF-ON-ON.
The other set of contacts is reversed but shares a connection with an adjacent pole, in other words the switch sections have one pole bridged. Between that and the center-ON bit I haven't been able to come up with a circuit that works without shorting out. But it has to be possible right? I mean, you can raise and lower the passenger's side door without touching the other switch so there has to be a way. I just don't know what it is.

Anyway, photos later.

Jim

[Preform Resources]

You guys have probably seen these folks advertising in street rod mags  http://www.specialtypowerwindows.com/ but they have them that fit in the early cars and are not terribly expensive.
Dave

[BlownMGB-V8]

Dave, the ones I was able to find said they needed 8" below the window. Clearly you had a different one in mind. Looks like price is around $400?

Here's the RX8 window mechanism, laying on the MGB door, approximately in the location where it will be mounted, though the track is 3" too long.



Here you can see the difference in original curvature, and reduced to match the MGB window.



Here the end is cut off and the new T shaped cutout drilled. Some chisel and file work and it is ready.



This is my pivot bracket. Eventually I welded studs to it once I knew where I wanted them.



My outlay so far is $80. I found a diagram that I think explains the switches, both set of contacts are grounded in the center position and power is applied to the unbridged contacts. I should be able to work with that.

Jim

[MGBV8]

Real sports cars don't even have side windows, much less electric windows.  Just when I thought you ditched the sissy shifter, now this....