No oil pressure on rebuilt 215

62Healeyhacker · April 30, 2019, 12:41:55 PM

Still zero oil pressure when I spin the pump through the distributor shaft. I have replaced the front cover and oil pump. What are the most likely causes? (I may have not gotten all the air out when I forced petroleum jelly into the pump.)

Also: I added the steel shim to bottom of pump to eliminate the wear problem. In doing so i made is impossible to change the oil filter without loosening a motor mount and lifting the engine a bit. ( i'm using the shortest filter that fits.) The pre'94 Rover V8 has a pump cover which faces directly forward. Yet I have never seen a 215 Buick using this. Any ideas? ( D and D doesn't list the swivel mounts on their website any longer.)

Any suggestions greatly appreciated.

MGBV8 · April 30, 2019, 03:21:48 PM

How did you force the petroleum jelly into the pump? Did you take it apart & pack it?

62Healeyhacker · April 30, 2019, 05:24:43 PM

It was done two years ago. I believe the new pump was installed in the new front cover after it was on the engine. I recall the difficulty
with the petroleum jelly because I was on my back in my garage.

ex-tyke · April 30, 2019, 06:12:08 PM

Are you driving the distributor shaft/pump in the CW direction when priming?

tr8todd · May 01, 2019, 06:04:53 AM

Had a similar problem on a fresh rebuild once. Turned out the gasket on the pickup tube shifted and was covering the hole in the tube. Only one bolt went there the holes in the gasket. Pull the cover and repack the pump before you try anything else. Another trick is to over fill the sump with oil. The higher the oil level, the easier it is to lift the oil with the pump. Get it high enough and it will fill the pump on its own. Fill the filter with oil before you try and prime the pump.

MGBV8 · May 01, 2019, 09:23:08 AM

Check that your oil pressure relief valve is assembled correctly. Mine wasn't.

Don't go by what is listed or not listed on D&D's website. Call them.

88v8 · May 02, 2019, 04:16:55 AM

Few years ago replaced the gears in my pump, then same as you, couldn't get any pressure.
Turned out the paper cover gasket was too thick.
I got a replacement from ahhh, JE Engineering I think it was, that fixed it. Oil pressure in a couple of seconds with the drill.

As said, fill the filter first.

The petroleum jelly does dry out, needs to be packed well in.

Ivor

MGBV8 · May 02, 2019, 10:55:46 AM

Yes, the gasket sets the clearance between the gears & the housing.

62Healeyhacker · May 03, 2019, 04:12:17 PM

Thanks for the multiple suggestions.
I have a hunch the gasket where the filler tube attaches leaks air. I will try that first. I hate to pull the cover again but may need to do it to check the pump to face clearance and to get fresh petroleum oil fully packed.

Yes I have been spinning the shaft clockwise. Got something right!

62Healeyhacker · May 08, 2019, 05:06:02 PM

Here's what I have tried, without success.
I removed the filter and pump cover. With the gears down I packed the chamber with petroleum jelly. I loaded the shaft with jelly and the driven gear. Also stuffed the other gear with jelly. When I pushed them up into the chamber I wiped off the considerable excess petroleum jelly.
Using a "metric" pump cover from Silver-seal I screwed the cover and filter up tight.
Spinning the pump shaft drive clockwise I could feel the strain as the pump spun the jelly. I had high hopes that it was sucking through the pump then pushing the oil into the block. STILL NO PRESSURE!
I pulled the pan to check the gasket where the oil tube connects to the block. Not a problem.

I have ordered a new oil pan gasket.
Now what?

minorv8 · May 09, 2019, 05:05:38 AM

I recently primed my engine. I have never used jelly, simply ran a drill as long as it primes. This time it took quite long, maybe a minute or two. But primed anyway. I don´t know for how long you have tried but it may take some time.

MG four six eight · May 12, 2019, 01:32:42 AM

I made an engine pre-luber out of an old brake pressure bleeder tank. Basically I put motor oil in it instead of brake fluid and then made an adapter fitting to connect where the oil pressure gauge sender (or pipe) attaches to the pump. Works well and pre-lubes the entire engine as well as priming the pump.

BlownMGB-V8 · May 12, 2019, 11:40:00 AM

You could also use a speed-sprayer for that. I haven't, but it wouldn't be hard to do.

Jim

40indianss · May 13, 2019, 12:04:05 AM

Please enlighten me. What is a speed sprayer?

BlownMGB-V8 · May 13, 2019, 08:48:48 AM

Sorry, Speedy-Sprayer. Huh, couldn't find it. Maybe that was just a colloquialism. Here ya go:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oG2NNt2ZeDQ

Jim

40indianss · May 13, 2019, 11:38:00 PM

Might be a specific store brand or manufacturer and picture was worth a thousand words. I have several different iterations in my shop. Thanks for the info and should be simple to adapt

Young olds · May 30, 2019, 01:43:06 AM

I had to replace my front cover and now my engine only has about 25psi cold, previously I had about 70. I ran the pump with a drill until it sprayed oil out of the remote oil filter port. Could I be suffering from a priming issue? I did not know about packing the pump with jelly

88v8 · May 30, 2019, 04:42:53 AM

New cover, or used?
I think you have to look at the pressure relief valve, and the clearances in the pump. Including, as I mentioned, the thickness of the cover gasket.
http://www.v8wizard.com/oil-pump-no-gasket.php
Unfortunately, he doesn't say what the thickness should be, but I do know that too thick destroys the pressure.

They prime easier with jelly, but once it's primed then it's down to clearances.

Ivor

Young olds · May 30, 2019, 09:18:33 AM

I did some reading and believe you are correct. It is a used cover with remote oil filter adapter plate.

MGBV8 · May 30, 2019, 01:11:33 PM

This for Buick 225 V6, but should be the same or very close for the Buick/Olds/Rover aluminum V8s.

QuoteThe Specs for End Play clearance are .0023-.0058. Obviously tighter is better and I like to see them at .002-.004 max. T.A. Performance sells a gasket shim kit # TA-1704 that helps to attain those close specs. If the gear bore side walls are grooved or if worn to the point whereby the clearance between the gears and wall exceeds .006-.007 thousands it may be time to think about getting another timing cover.........Spec for side clearance is .003-.005.

http://www.earlycj5.com/xf_cj5/index.php?threads/blueprint-225.118867/page-5

88v8 · May 31, 2019, 04:00:13 AM

Presume it had a remote filter previously?
They do somewhat drop the pressure.
Although not that much.

Seems that the brand of filter can also influence oil pressure, if you changed that at the same time?
https://www.dsmtuners.com/threads/oil-filter-causes-change-in-oil-pressure.448506/
Or perhaps this is folklore.

Ivor

Young olds · May 31, 2019, 11:49:58 AM

Previously I had the filter right off the timing cover, I had to undo a motor mount and tip the engine to remover filter, so while I was changing the timing cover I went to a remote filter

Young olds · May 31, 2019, 09:51:48 PM

I removed the fittings, pressure relief and filter bypass, from the remote filter adapter. The bypass did not have a spring like the stock oil filter adapter but the pressure relief appeared to be the same as stock. I stretched the spring and now I have zero oil pressure. I think I am going to have to remove the adapter and give it a better look. Engine is not making any noise like you would expect from zero oil pressure.

Young olds · May 31, 2019, 11:59:00 PM

Ok, so earlier today I started the car so my dad could hear it, I had 30psi. I took both fittings out of the filter adapter and stretched the spring for pressure bypass, 0psi after that. I took the adapter off and saw that I had two gaskets between the timing cover/pump housing and filter adapter. Removed one, which looked quite a bit thinner then the one I left but it was ripped, still 0psi. Last thing I tried was to replace the stretched spring with another I had, still 0psi. Any ideas? Btw when I first ran it, even though the oil pressure was low for cold it only dropped 10psi after it had been at temp. And another thing I noticed is the lines to the remote filter did not have much oil in them, I figured if it was pumping oil the lines would be full even if I had low pressure.

88v8 · June 01, 2019, 05:09:38 AM

Hmm. So you made two change at the same time. The cover, and the filter.

If you really had 0psi then lifters would be rattling, and by now, the rod ends.

The filter, if tilted downwards, needs to be of a type with an anti-drainback valve.

Given your filter access problem, can understand you making the change to a remote.
Otoh, how often does one change the filter?

Think I'd take the easy way out and put it back as it was. Then if you still have a problem, it's the cover.

Long and short filters are available, if that helps.

Ivor